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Monday, November 2, 2015

Anarchy in the GOP Presidential Debate Version

We looked at this after the implosion of Kevin McCarthy's candidacy for Speaker.

http://lastmenandovermen.blogspot.com/2015/10/has-modern-gop-reached-limits-of.html?showComment=1444441587728#c1460648126903104314

Then there has been this entire GOP primary where according to a poll released by Survey Monkey last Friday two candidates with zero experience in government-Carson and Trump-have almost 60% of the primary vote.

This was my argument to Tom Brown in our usual comments discussion.

" I wonder how the Democrats could use this kerfuffle over the GOP debates to their advantage... I think they should somehow make fun of them for this."

"Paint their desire to avoid "gotcha questions" as a desire to avoid questions they don't want to answer."

http://lastmenandovermen.blogspot.com/2015/11/mitch-mcconnell-is-unusually-functional.html?showComment=1446469135225#c5588455619011621135

He did have a real good idea where Hillary can joke when someone asks her a question that this is a gotcha question and she's not going to answer it.

But overall, I don't think Dems have to do too much. The GOP by now has made it clear how self-immolating it really is. Why fight it?

The Dems don't need to do anything that will put attention on them rather than the clown car that is the GOP.

An opponent as nihilistic and self-destructive as the GOP is the best opponent of all: they do all the work themselves. Why even bother laying a glove on them?

However, this leads us to the latest GOP anarchy. Anarchy is the result of purism, ironically. Unity requires compromise and the agreement to agree rather than disagree.

But the GOP is splitting apart as there is no ability for anyone to look out for the big picture best interests of the party.

Reince Priebus is the latest GOP institutional leader to end up on the cross hairs.

Josh Marshall has a great analogy for Priebus as the new Boehner.

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/edblog/is-reince-the-new-boehner

As Slate says, the GOP is now highjacking it's own debate process:

"The GOP’s Presidential Contenders Are Hijacking Their Own Debates"

"The Republican Party has lost control of its own primary. Expect chaos."

"In a Godfather-esque gathering of rival political concerns, representatives of the Republican presidential campaigns gathered in an Alexandria, Virginia Hilton on Sunday evening to draw up a list of conditions for their participation in future presidential debates. The campaigns still are all het up about the completely unfair questioning that business-Republican network CNBC subjected them to last week, such as, Marco Rubio, your tax plan is really good for the wealthy, no? or, Ben Carson, why were you in bed with this snake-oil company for so many years? If the moderators had asked fair questions, see, the candidates wouldn’t have been forced to lie. What’s so complicated about that?

"The campaigns and their consiglieres put together a list of demands to which future debate hosts must agree to ensure the candidates’ participation. The finalized version, as obtained by the Washington Post, is hilarious in its granularity. Not oncebut twice does the document inveigh against “lightening [sic] rounds,” which must be banned “because of their frivolousness or ‘gotcha’ nature, or in some cases both.” The letter also implores networks to agree not to “ask the candidates to raise their hands to answer a question,” “allow candidate-to-candidate questioning,” “allow props or pledges by the candidates,” “show an empty podium after a break (describe how far away the bathrooms are),” or “leaves microphones on after breaks.” What about allowing hot mics in the distant bathrooms? There’s no clear rule on that, though it would certainly violate the spirit of the letter."

http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/politics/2015/11/republican_presidential_candidates_issue_debate_demands_to_networks_reince.html

By the way, Kasich couldn't have fallen more flat in his attempt to call out Trump and Carson for their 'ridiculous' ideas.

http://lastmenandovermen.blogspot.com/2015/10/kasich-comes-in-frisky-but-trump-tars.html

Trump really did rip him apart with a couple of words: Fracking and Lehman Brothers. But more fundamentally this is the whole trouble with those who just focus on how crazy Trump and Ben Carson's proposals are.

Trump's plan calls for $9 trillion dollars in tax cuts that won't blow up the deficit. Jeb Calls for $4 trillion dollars in tax cuts that won't' explode the deficit.

Kasich's plan is very similar.

http://www.taxjusticeblog.org/archive/2015/10/although_he_left_out_key_detai.php#.Vjfk9rerTC0

All the GOPer tax plans are budget busting creative supply side fiction. Kasich simply is calling the kettle black.

Yet we're supposed to be shocked by Trump's plan but not Kasich?




12 comments:

  1. Look Mike, Rubio comes in #1 in USA Today's "Power Rankings":
    http://onpolitics.usatoday.com/2015/11/03/repubican-power-rankings-rubio-christie/

    Lol... what does it mean?!?!... Rubio is #1???... or USA Today **wishes** he were #1?

    Maybe you should come out with your own "Super Power Rankings+" (now with more power!), and rearrange the list however you see fit.

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  2. Obama ridicules the petunias and pansies which constitute the GOP field:

    "They say, when I talk to Putin, he’s going to straighten out...Then it turns out they can’t handle a bunch of CNBC moderators...If you can’t handle those guys, I don’t think the Chinese and the Russians are going to be too worried about you."

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  3. Yes, Obama hit that one out of the park.

    On those power rankings, you've nailed it.I'ts who they think should be number one.

    I've gone through who I think is up there. I actually agree with the Rubio team.

    http://lastmenandovermen.blogspot.com/2015/10/rubios-team-handicaps-primary.html

    I think right now four candidates have a real chance-the others are just pretenders.

    Carson, Trump, and the two Cubans-Rubio and Cruz

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    Replies
    1. I still think Hillary (or Sanders or O'Malley) should take my suggestion though when asked a tough question at the next debate. If it's Hillary, she could have quadruple fun with it actually. Let me refine my previous example dialog from her:

      "I refuse to answer that nasty biased 'gotcha' question until you provide clear proof that you sir, are a LOYAL Democrat!!!"

      [stunned silence and crickets]

      "Of course I'm joking... What do you think I am? A delicate Republican petunia?... on the verge of wilting under these hot lights and tough questions? I sat though many sessions of hostile insulting questions from a whole panel of right wing partisan ideologues... the most recent of which went on for 11 hours! The pansy-Party whines about the media being a "Democratic Super-Pac"... well, the GOP dominated congress has becomes the ultimate GOP Super-Pac!!! I'd like to see someone like Mr. Cruz (who's apparently desperate scrub the moderator's panel clean of any ideological impurities) last five minutes under truly hostile questioning!"

      That would ridicule Carson ('gotcha'), Cruz, Rubio ('Super PAC') and Trump (by including 'nasty'), and highlight the vast chasm between her own abilities to stand up under hostile partisan questions and the delicate flowers that wilt under hot lights and questions that deviate from scripts (the 'hot lights' ridicules their recent manifesto that states the GOP debate room needs to be no hotter than 67 degrees).

      What do you think? In bowling that would be a "strike" don't you think? She could pack so much ridicule into just a few sentences, that it would be highly memorable wouldn't it?

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    2. Also, I think in response the DNC should hold a press conference of their own and announce that they are going to suspend their relationship with whatever network is hosting their next debate until and unless the network agrees to include at least one of the following moderators: then they list of a set of center right moderators... ones that wouldn't be too disruptive, but nonetheless, ones that would draw a further distinction between the pussy-Party and their own.

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    3. Say they named Hugh Hewitt for example. And say the network in question actually agreed to invite Hugh. What would he do? If he agrees, then he helps the Democrats showcase the difference between themselves and the pansies in his party. If he doesn't, then he misses a golden opportunity. In a sense, the Democrats specifically requesting that he be included ruins it for him!! Lol... I'm guessing he'd decline.

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    4. This may be risky... but I'm imagining that Hillary can somehow work in some sort of stylized floral print on whatever she wears. It'd have to be fairly subdued, ... and it could lead to accusations that this was all rehearsed. But it would be great somehow to have a visual reminder of her flower metaphor for the GOP field. Also, having the flowers on her person is a risk... so perhaps not a good idea overall.

      It seems like they could have so much fun with this though... in fact, to maximize the effect, it'd be hilarious if all three of the Democratic candidates worked in some short but pointed ridicule of the Republicans on this point... demonstrating the unity of the Democratic party in general... and the universal ridicule that the GOP deserves... and even further fracturing the GOP, since the GOP candidates are far from united about this debate thing... Bush wants a Spanish language network, Trump doesn't, Trump refuses to sign the letter they drafted, Christie, Kasich and others are critical of the letter and are not signing either. Christie doesn't want an "all right wing" panel of moderators and Cruz does. What if Laura Ingraham and Erick Erickson were invited to be part of the panel? Ingraham has openly ridiculed Carson on her website. What about Coulter? She's openly ridicules Rubio. Even the 67 degrees upper bound on the temperature seems rife for division... will Fiorina really sign up for that? (It seems like every woman I've ever known gets cold at a higher temperature than do men... plus it's likely that she'll wear a skirt with her lower legs exposed as she's done in the past)

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    5. Overall, I'm not sure what the optimal outcome of all this is: that Cruz gets his way and the next debate turns into a extreme right wing echo chamber, where the moderators drive each candidate to highlight their right wing nuttiness? That the debates completely unravel and Trump ends up hosting them in his casinos... only inviting who he wants... while others are left on their own to host their own. Or that this whole revolt is put down under an avalanche of public ridicule... and the candidates sheepishly hand control back to the RNC and refuse to talk about it anymore.

      All of those possibilities seem like wins for the Democrats.

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    6. It seems to me that all these possibilities work for Democrats. That's the beauty of having such a wild, Kamikaze opponent.

      I do like the Hillary response-about only registered Democrats asking questions. LOL.

      I suspect that we may have reached that point where any outcome is going to be fairly optimum for the Dems

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    7. I still want to see the SNL skit wherein there's a debate between delicate flowers: a petunia, a daffodil, a pansy, a daisy, a buttercup, a tulip, a forget-me-not, a gladiolus, a lilac, a passion-flower, a periwinkle, a primrose, a satin-flower, a wallflower, and queen-Anne's lace. That should cover it.

      The actors can be shown in their immobile pots, dressed as these flowers (somehow it should be obvious which candidate corresponds to each flower)... one can whine about it being too hot as he bends over helplessly wilting... sweat dripping from his furrowed brow, until a stage hand comes out to water him. The moderators can be depicted as caterpillars... harmless enough looking, but terrifying to these delicate flowers.

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  4. I would certainly like a SNL satire of this, agreed.

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    Replies
    1. Kasich's flower can be a marijuana bud in light of his state's ballot initiatives.

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